JOURNALIST:My first question is about US politics. I imagine you know about McCain’s candidacy and about what he said about classes on Creation in schools, about the messages that need to be given about Creation in class. May I learn your thoughts on this?

ADNAN OKTAR:McCain thinks quite correctly on this subject. Creationism and Darwinism should be taught in the same environment, but both should be given the same rights. Creationism should be described as much as Darwinism is. In other words, when talking about Creationism, the errors of Darwinism must also be set out. Darwinism should also be described unilaterally, but its scientific criticism must also definitely be made. For example, there are 100 million fossils, but Darwinism never mentions them; 100 million fossils that prove Creation. Darwinism lacks even a single transitional fossil to back up its own claims. This is never mentioned in scientific books, for instance, but it should be. For example, it is technically impossible for a protein to come into being by chance. Yet, Darwinism never mentions that. But it should be mentioned. Darwinism generally speaks of miracles; it says how this or that happened by miracle. These things need to be talked about. I mean, no scientific account is given, it just talks of miracles. Who creates the miracle? That is what Darwinism needs to say.

JOURNALIST:Let us come to the main issue, if you will. What do these fossils teach us? What is the message these fossils give us?

ADNAN OKTAR:Images of all life forms have remained underground, as you know, just like photographs, that is what I mean by fossils. An animal’s petrified body. These are living things dating back 50, 100 or 200 million years. Crocodiles, rabbits, tigers, lions and pigs; when we look at the fossil records of all animal species we see the animal has never changed, that it was the same as it is today. But Darwinists never mention that, they keep this hidden. That should be mentioned. Since they have never changed, since they are the same as when they were first created, that means there is no evolution. I mean, it is clear this Creation did not come about through evolution. That is a scientific fact. But if they have alternative accounts to give, if they imagine that is possible as to their own thinking, then they can do that, but not using Darwin. When it comes to Darwinism, that is in a state of total collapse. Everyone in Europe has realized that. Darwinism is a deception. It is satan’s way of mocking mankind, ridiculing. Chance can do nothing. You do not get a newspaper article or a magazine article when you throw a handful of sand on the ground. It just scatters at random. In fact, Allah creates that, too, but nothing comes of it.

JOURNALIST:Let us say that Darwinism really is false and a theory that cannot be proved. How does that automatically prove the existence of God?

ADNAN OKTAR:They may claim that aliens from space created. They may propose similar fantastical ideas, but everyone will see that, of course. It is clear that Allah created. In other words, the whole world agrees that if there is no Darwinism then Allah must have created. But they may perhaps launch various fantastical ideas. But when asked who created those space creatures, they will again have to say that Allah created them. At the end of the day, everything will revert to Allah.

JOURNALIST:People are curious about this; the ideas you set out in your books, what you say about Darwinism represent a position in the face of science, and in one sense you set your own position out within another scientific framework. So are there two different types of science?

ADNAN OKTAR:Darwinism is a position opposed to science, a view that sets out dishonesty and mendacity in the face of science. But in our creationist views that we elucidate, the scientific evidence is all set out, 100 million fossils for example. Fossil exhibitions are held and people touch fossils with their own hands. That is science. They see them with their own eyes, and that is science. For example, it has been proven with bio-mathematics that a protein cannot form by chance, and that is science. Darwinism is therefore a pagan religion based on utter nonsense, a dogma. It has nothing to do with science. But what I talk about is totally rooted in science, clear, explicit and definite accounts completely founded in scientific proofs.

JOURNALIST:There is such a picture before us; that it is as if you knew the conclusion beforehand, and that you collected the data for this conclusion you say is scientific only subsequently, to prove a conclusion that already existed in your mind. What would you say to that?

ADNAN OKTAR:But the existence of Allah is completely clear and manifest. The existence in the human brain of a full-color, 3-D world, the image of the person he is talking to being in that same place, its forming in the brain, sound forming in stereo in the brain more perfectly than with any music system and someone seeing that image, someone seeing inside of the brain and hearing that sound in the brain. This is something that definitively proves the existence of Allah, totally excluding any other possibility. We can see the existence of Allah from that evidence. But Darwinism is a different issue; something that is proven with technical evidence. This is something people can see and experience. But Darwinism is a theory explicitly criticized by the scientific evidence and that is exposed to be a deception and fraudulence..

JOURNALIST:When you first set out, was your mindset to prove the existence of Allah or else Darwinism?

ADNAN OKTAR:I already believed in the existence of Allah because the proofs of His existence are crystal clear. It is clear from the perfection of the universe, from what I have just discussed. There is matter on the outside, but we continually experience it as an image in our brains. There is no alternative explanation to this. But I saw that Darwinism was the work of fraud as a result of my own research. Darwinism hides fossils away, for example. Go to museums and you will not find many fossils there, only very rarely. Yet there are 100 million fossils in the world. That by itself is enough to reveal the dishonesty of Darwinism. Second, there are the facts about the false nature of the skulls. There are many false skulls that have been made use of by Darwinism. Their fraudulence has been scientifically proven, and even Darwinists now admit it. It is a fact, in other words. They admit that proteins cannot come into being by chance. They cannot account for how the first cell came into being, they explain it by miracle. But what I most concentrate on is the complete lack of transitional fossils. Darwin himself said the lack of transitional fossils refuted his theory, and there exists not one transitional fossil. Just telling people about that will put the whole matter to rest. It is explicit proof of the absolute defeat of Darwinism.

JOURNALIST:Why is it important to prove the existence of Allah? Is it not enough to believe in Him?

ADNAN OKTAR:Criticism of Darwinism is not solely intended to prove the existence of Allah, because we can clearly see His existence from the evidence I have just cited and the perfection in the universe. Had Allah wished, He could have created the universe through evolution, as Darwin said, and that would have been compatible with the Qur’an, and the Torah and the Gospels, and we would happily have said that Allah created the universe through evolution. But when we examined the theory of evolution through a rational look, we saw it was laughably packed full of frauds and trickery. In other words, hundreds of millions of people are being blatantly deceived, and Darwinism is under official state protection. If Darwinism were not under states’ official protection it would come to an end in a matter of weeks. It is only official protection keeping it alive. First of all, this official protection is most mysterious. Only this theory enjoys official protection in just about all states, in about 95% of them, in schools and universities and official bodies. People should realize there is some serious trickery going on behind this. And when we examine this theory we see it consists of hundreds of tricks and frauds. It has absolutely nothing scientific about it. Darwinism is not a theory with anything scientific about it. But geology, paleontology and biomathematics are sciences, however, Darwinism is a hoax totally based on fraud.

JOURNALIST:I know from your books that you ascribe such evil forces as fascism, Nazi and socialism to Darwinism and say that Darwinism is their root cause. What can you tell us about that?

ADNAN OKTAR:Hitler said that himself, Mussolini said that himself, and Marx said that himself. These persons themselves say that they were influenced by Darwinism and that their ideas or theories stemmed from it, and we can see that from their books or other works. And we also see that from the application of the ideology. Social Darwinism has been implemented by savage capitalism, fascism and communist thinking all over the world, and is still being so applied. They possess an idea of thesis-antithesis-synthesis. They also have the idea of the strong fighting the weak and the strong always winning. They apply that to society. But the fact is that right is might, but might is not right. That error will be put right in this century.

JOURNALIST:Of course we certainly cannot defend Nazism, what the Nazis did or fascism; these were evil happenings. But Darwin lived long before those people, and how can Darwin be blamed for their being influenced by him? How can we seek to blame Darwin for that?

ADNAN OKTAR:I am not seeking to blame Darwin. Darwin simply made a huge mistake stemming from the scientific inadequacies of that age, from ignorance being widespread and from the lack of technical equipment. Then science progressed. The electron microscope appeared, biomathematics appeared, technology made vast progress and there were great advances in paleontology and a hundred million or so fossils were discovered, not one of which appeared in the form Darwin described. They were all of a nature such as to prove creation, and Darwin’s only mistake was therefore to make a claim based on such scientific deficiency. But as science progressed it proved that Darwin’s theory was a totally fictitious one and science demolished Darwinism.

JOURNALIST:I would like briefly to go back to America. Have you any thoughts of a partnership with your publishers and America? In order to spread these ideas in America, to tell people about them, especially in the wake of McCain’s latest statements, the latest developments there?

ADNAN OKTAR:It is good that McCain has come out against Darwinism, but the American public are only now becoming aware of that deception. So a serious worldwide awakening has not yet begun. But there is still a very rapid and intense awakening. But it is impossible to collaborate with them at the moment for this trickery and deception to be overcome, because they are as yet unaware of the danger. If they were aware they would in any case adopt their own measures, but I think it will still take more time for this theory that enjoys official protection, protection by states, to be totally eradicated from the world. I mean, there needs to be a bit more effort put in. If these people believed in its scientific credentials they should lift that protection so we can deal with the theory on a free environment. In that case, people will immediately see that the theory is a hallucination, and it will at once be defeated and eliminated.

JOURNALIST:Why should states wish to protect Darwinism?

ADNAN OKTAR:Because [atheist] freemasonry rules the states of the world, I mean, almost 95% of states are under control of [atheist] freemasons. Darwinism is also a pagan religion; [atheist] freemasonry protects it across the world and has imposed in on states either directly or indirectly. For example, in no country can people stand up and say; 100 million fossils have been discovered to date and you are still finding them, then why do you not put these fossils on show? There are a lot of museums, a lot of official, publicly-owned museums. Why do you not show us them there? Yet if these fossils were put on display there would in fact be no need to go on about explaining the invalidity of Darwinism. The public will look and realize at once that no change has taken place and the issue will be resolved of its own accord. That is why there has been a serious reaction to the fossil exhibitions in Turkey, too, but fossil exhibitions have still been held everywhere. The number of people who today believe in Darwinism in Turkey has fallen to nearly zero; 90-95% of people in Turkey do not believe in Darwinism.

JOURNALIST:How did you get close to that figure?

ADNAN OKTAR:The internet has had a huge impact. Book sales were very influential. And our nation is one predisposed to believe in Allah, a devoutly faithful nation. They did not have much doubts on the subject. The nation also thinks very positively and rationally regarding the facts. So they did not make it a matter of pride and prolong the issue needlessly. They reached a definitive conclusion when they saw the facts. Fossil exhibitions have been held in Ankara and Istanbul and Izmir. The public saw the fossils for themselves and touched them with their own hands and saw them with their own eyes. They reached the definite conclusion that Darwinism is a deception. Just about nobody disputes that at the time being.

JOURNALIST:I have one last question. Why do human beings have tail bones?

ADNAN OKTAR:That serves many purposes. It protects the internal organs against shocks and has many aspects that are useful in the body. It is also where many muscles are attached to. It is a structure that protects several internal organs, buffers them from external shocks and makes life easier.

JOURNALIST:Thank you very much.